Gary and I were just conversing and we wondered how much it really matters that scores are kept at the fun shoots. We can see several advantages either way, but we want your opinion. Think about it and take the poll to the right.
We think that some people may be relieved if scores were not kept, and would be less hesitant to shoot if others didn't know how well (or poorly) they shot. It may be more relaxing. Less performance anxiety, so to speak. It would also allow some to shoot a little closer or farther than the defined distances. If there are no scores there will be no cheating. Scoring some of the stages also takes a lot of time, so perhaps the shoot would move along better without it. No scores would make life a lot easier on Gary and Mark for sure.
On the other hand, some people may really be into it for the competition, and without scoring they may have no interest at all in the Fun Shoots.
Please feel free to comment also.
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17 comments:
Personally, it would allow me some freedom to experiment, and it would make it more likely for my peers and I to talk each other into doing stupid stuff. Like shooting claybirds from farther away, and using a timer on the USPSA stages without having to worry about it affecting our scoresheets. The guys I shoot with and I would still probably keep some kind of informal tally so we could determine who is better. We usually know that anyway even without looking at the totals.
This is a FUN shoot. Scoring brings in a competitive vein that wins bragging rights, and can be destructive to the spirit of the funshoot. I personally do not care about my score, I use the funshoot as an excuse to practice my accuracy or to play with something I usually do not shoot, which means my score will stink anyway. It's up to you, it is your shoot, if you want it, we'll keep it, but it might be more fun without it, and a bit more creative. Small groups can always keep score with in themselves.... And if it doesn't work,we can always change beck. I am for dropping the scoing. We will still have a year end trophy shoot, complete with scoring.
Let's put the Fun back in the Fun shoots and forget about score sheets. We have to deal with all of that at our IPSC matches. This will probably make it less stressfull for the newer shooters as well.
Sounds like a good deal - just shooting up birds and other fun things that go splat or just blow up real well. There are plenty of timed and scored events in the area to satisfy the most competitive pistol junkies...
Strictly .22 (or name your caliber) shoots, food shoots (who can blast a brussel sprout at 15 yards with a .22 - only good use for one in my humble opinion.. :D ), cookies, etc.
You're onto something, Gary - sounds like fun to boot!
So far, I've been to 2 fun shoots and 1 USPSA shoot. As a new guy, the fun shoots are seriously FUN as they are! I like the time/comp pressure (even a little bit), and don't think anybody takes it seriously enough to ruin anybody's experience of the day. Has anybody complained about being psyched out by the pressure at a fun shoot? Compared to the testosterone at the USPSA shoot, I thought it was a piece of cake.
We backed off the competition at another club I shoot at. The fun matches got silly/sloppy, people did not progress in their skills, and attendance dropped.
My $.02, but I think they are a high quality shooting experience. Unless it's broke, don't fix it.
I agree that the fun shoot is becoming a little more competitive but I don't think that removing the scoring will help. I attend the fun shoot because I can't shoot the USPSA matches on Sunday. I like having scoring because it allows me to keep track of my progress in my training.
Instead of removing the scoring, how about keeping it in place, make it optional, whoever wants to keep score can, and don't bother with running a list of scores following the shoot. I really don't care what other people shoot, I just use the scoring to make sure that I'm improving.
I sort of like it the way it is now. My Daughter and grand daughter like to compete against each other and me. It's not so important that we compete with others but it is nice to know where you stand overall. We don't get bent out of shape if we are having a bad day. We all know it is a "fun shoot" and treat it so.
It doesn't matter if the stage "rules" interpretation get a bit fuzzy. Each squad can determine how they will shoot the stage if the "rules" are ambiguous. I hate to see us get into the PC position where "scoring" is somehow detrimental to our self esteem.
As far as intimidation for new shooters goes, It should be stated before hand that scoring does not mean anything except an indication of your present, relative abilities. As you shoot you will show improvement. That's the whole purpose to scoring in a fun shoot. If you don't score, how do you know how you are doing?? Plus, in any squad I ever shot in at the fun shoots, everyone is willing to help any new shooters anyway they can, because it is a fun shoot.
Now we get back to the PC thing, again. If a person is so uptight about being outdone by someone, I don't even want to be shooting next to such a person. This sport is for emotionally stable people only.
It's a freaking fun shoot ..........lets have fun...................
I'm torn for sure. I don't even tally up my score sometimes, however, when I'm on I do like to see how I'm doing...
As a stepping stone to more competitive shoots the scoring helps put pressure on when you want it, a good attitude allows you to laugh when you're not hitting.
I'll come either way though..
I do like what you guys are doing now it seems like there is something for all experience levels, I have only shot the fun shoot twice and would sugjest that if you want to experiment then go right ahead, it's your match and don't have scoring for a stage that is experimental. That would also be a great place to have a "go in blind stage". Not blind folded but not seeing the stage before you go in which would be a great real practical experience.
I agree that I like the fun-shoots the way they are. If a participant doesn't wish to score his/her own...that is fine, but I don't think anyone isn't having fun because their score is low (or high for that matter). It is a good way to judge how you are doing on a continual basis.. Keep the score sheets is my vote.
I think it's worth trying; you can always revert to the old way if this doesn't work. People who really want to keep score can do so on their own anyway. The one caveat is that you don't want to allow TOO much "experimenting" if it begins to slow up the flow of the shoot. (e.g., major rearrangements of a stage so a couple people can try something new) But that's something a good squad leader can police.
By experimenting I didn't mean change the stages, just use a timer or shoot from farther away, maybe use each others guns. Definitely not do anything that would slow down the shoot. How cool would it be to decide that everyone on a particular stage gets to use Ben's Open gun, or some weird thing somebody brought? The other thing is we could try it without scoresheets for a couple months and if we didn't like it go right back. We're just thinking outside the box here. As we said originally individuals or squads may elect to keep score for themselves for bragging rights or to keep track of progress, but we wouldn't post results.
I kinda agree with Bernie. You all know that my Dad and I like to compare scores and challenge each other.
I enjoy the competition but the fun shoots for me are more about getting out for a good part of the day and doing something I enjoy. I use the time to improve my skills and may try to shoot an entire event strong or week hand only for practice or use my smaller carry pistol. Scoring is fine with me, just make the scoring as simple as possible, Go / No-Go type scoring (like bulls-eyes and steel). I can imagine the orginizers already have enough to do without debating scores.
How about only scoring half of the stages - especially the wacky stuff that is a real challenge? Fig Newtons & Paint Balls! Bring it on! :o)
Competition for me has always been fun. Will I ever be a top gun, I doubt it , nor will I be able to compete with Tiger at golf. Managing the results is not fun, however we could still have score sheets and compete with ourselves or our" buddy for the day ".
I think the fun shoots are fine the way they are. I would just change the scoring dont score them like a USPSA shoot. This way you can take out some of the pressure for the real good shooters and still challage the new ones.
I like keeping score because it helps me focus on what I am trying to do...become a better shooter. I will say that the Aries Ram in me is quite competitive, but more with myself and with my family members than anyone else. I would never condone using scoring and performance levels as a method to degrade other participants. After all, we are here to have fun and to improve our shooting all at the same time.
If scoring as it is currently known goes away, I am pretty sure that I will still keep my own score mentally--simply "hit" or "miss" as the case may be. No scoring method should interfere with the fun or with the shooting--that's why other sports have refs.
However, I would hate to see things get too loose that safety is compromised. The scoring and pit directions keep everyone on the same page. I like having a standard goal and perpetuating safe handgun use at the same time since I bring my teenage daughter to the shoots.
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